Announcement Announcement Module
Collapse
No announcement yet.
How do you do it ? (lvl 20+) Page Title Module
Move Remove Collapse
This topic is closed.
X
X
Conversation Detail Module
Collapse
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    I don't know DF very well, but make sure the prepatory attack you've selected has a good initiative+ bonus on it. For instance, I use a prep attack that gives me 20 initiative each time it hits. Some give as little as 10 initiative. You might be using one of the lower initiative generating prep attacks.

    Comment


    • #32
      Yes the pred attack is a low initiative one... (from memory) i think its weapon damage+17-22 balance damage and +5 initative (might be 10)

      two or three swipes from that move and its time to start putting the damage on, my plan was to get their balance <20 then land a bleed then just switch to standard attacks... they should fall fairly quickly with that combo.

      As it stands right now, i dont feel like i have much offensive capability other than my pistol and my grenade... guess i need to play with it a bit more

      Comment


      • #33
        Well it seems I was not the only one having issues with AvCom, it's good to see others benefitting from this thread.

        For me, since I respecced florentine and used the advice posted op top, I can now usually handle most AvCom missions, though some of them are still rediculous, like those with timed respawns, last night I ended up fighting 11 at once cause they spawned faster than I could kill, another is a "protect" inside, where they focus on the 40hp girl I had with me and cut her to shreds before I can begin.

        Some are just plain crap, others are easier now, but I must admit I find them boring and rarely worth the time and effort, because they are so uninvolved.

        One last question to all, have anyone beaten the second swashbuckling master ??, I cannot even TOUCH his balance no matter what I try

        Comment


        • #34
          Ok I just read the tips in this thread and respecced my level 22 pirate from DF to Florentine and I'm absolutely over the moon with the difference!

          I'm sure this has less to do with the fact that DF is weaker then Florentine and more to do with the fact that I really thought about what skills I would take this time around and the difference is simply crazy!

          I've currently got a Florentine build with the "Elegant Loop" for initiative and most other skills for Imp. active block and other defense-oriented skills. I also took a single off-hand swipe (forgot the name) to do some damage once the targets balance is down.

          So far I've completed a few AvCom missions and the whole way I fight has totally changes! With my DF build I could deal much more burst-damage but as soon as I had to fight anything over three people at the same time I basically either died or was able to kill the targets fast enough. Now with my new build I can tank 5 NPCs for ages simply by Elegant Looping the crap out of my target and activating Imp. Active Block. Then just hit the target a few times and let them bleed to death like the pigs they are (lol).

          The only situation where I think my old build may have been superior was in boarding combat against a high-level captain that didn't have any remaining waves. I was fighting against a level 37 captain (as a level 21 pirate) and I think the burst damage really helped me there... Just ran up to him, ordered everyone to "Push" and attack the captain and then bash his head in with max damage. I'm not sure how such a situation will pan-out exactly with my new build.

          I guess as soon as the enemy captain has more then zero waves remaining, my new build will be superior (because then I have to survive until the captain respawns and not just beat him to death as fast as I can without worrying about defense).

          I'm still going to have to test the battles at sea in detail but so far for AvCom and non-highlevel boarding combat I'm absolutely loving the Florentine build! I finally managed to finish this one AvCom mission where you have to kill three guys at the same time (all of them at least 3 levels above me) and I completed the mission without ever taking any serious damage!

          No more Smelling Salts for me!

          Thanks a bunch to Gustave Molyneux and everyone else for sharing their experiences. You just made me like AvCom!

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by WolfieThai View Post
            ...
            I didnt seem to generate much initiative during fights, knocking down their balance with the pred attacks didnt seem to give me much initative - certainly not enough to use a finishing blow. Wasnt much of a problem as with no balance the NPC's fell quite quickly, especially if i had allies. Whats your DF tactics for initative generation?

            Grenade, whilst fun and reasonably powerful just results in death after use, or at the very least, mass panic as everyone (whos still alive) is beating on you. Whats the best tactic for this skill?

            Flash powder and Improved FP. i used this a lot last night and found the results... uninspiring. I'd pull with pistol, order the crew to attack my target and drop an Imp FP when the NPC's got close, i would see the 'incapacitated' message float above everyone and within a second or two they had recovered... is this normal? I was expecting it to last longer than a few seconds... i pretty much stopped using it after an hour or so as i felt it wasnt really benefiting me much (if at all)

            I think i will respec again, now i have a better understanding of AvCom (thanks to this thread) i think i have a reasonable build in mind that would have a nice bleed in the middle.
            Given my issues with multiple enemies I opted for a build that is slower at low levels so yes the initiative gen is low. I've fixed that up a little with Hostility (1 skill point for an instant 40 init.)

            Are you using Grenade as your opener? I generally use it as an opener and pick an undamaged target for regular flash powder, then kill off a damaged target next. Also, are we talking boarding or missions? I find that grenade is less useful in boarding missions, although if you use it and follow with the mass hate debuff from wild swings (cost 4 points to get, but given my preference for AoE effects it was worth it).

            The improved flash powder is a short duration effect. I generally don't concern myself with my own deaths in boarding combat, and it's useful for getting off one last grenade or pistol shot if I've lost control of the aggro. It's also nice just as a toss in the middle of combat to give your troops a momentary boost. the single flash powder is useless in boarding (it's cancelled by any attack, and crew members cancel it all the time) but is amazing in missions.

            I currently have Powder Jockey 5, Low Blows 4, Wild Swings 4, and Pistols 3. I'm going to pick up Pistols to 5, as I think the second shot, and terrorize will be ridiculously useful in missions. I then intend to pick up the vicious line (bleeds) for damage boost against the higher end mobs now that their HP is starting to climb. I'm also considering picking up firecracker. I had it in Closed Beta, but its effect was difficult to guage.

            Vox Dargard

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by Azrac Holmskov View Post
              One last question to all, have anyone beaten the second swashbuckling master ??, I cannot even TOUCH his balance no matter what I try
              I do all these "master" missions in groups. They are infinitely easier that way. Given that I consider Avcom a hassle generally, it doesn't bother me that I can't solo this kind of mission.

              Vox Dargard

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by SwENSkE View Post
                Most AVCOM missions are pretty easy IF there's enough room between the enemies so you can drag them in groups of 3 max.

                Anyway there's one mission that's simply impossible - 'The wayward son'. It's inside and there's no way you can combat less than 5. I'm LV30 and I simply die, die, die in that mission. AVCOM is boring, boring, boring and the skills you can get are mostly useless (all these 'guard somebody else' skills are simply LOL). But if boring missions become impossible it gets ridiculous.
                This mission was ridiculous... I ended up burning like 4 or 5 smelling salts on it. Here is my recommendation, and how I ended up completing it. tab target the first mob. pull up your local map so you can see where the halls turn. Hit sprint, and run for the end. Use your smelling salt, and see if you can get to the NPC you need to talk to now without fighting. If not, use the same tactic again. This should plant all the enemies in the furthest back room. The spawn for the guy you have to rescue is random I think, so he might be in the furthest back room. If this is the case, leave the mission and restart.

                The alternative... get a group.

                Vox Dargard

                Comment


                • #38
                  ive run into a fork in the road with my florentiner..

                  up until now, ive been using and stacking as much parry as possible,
                  because i REALLY dont like the way active block is set up, in fact i loathe it utterly and refuse to touch it.

                  did the lvl20 quest, and naturally chose the gloves with the +parry mod on them..
                  got the message "fencer only" when trying to equip them :/

                  It seems that in my noobness ive been tricked into thinking that any style can go multiple ways, while in fact theres is only one path thats intended for each style.

                  Is florentine really all about long drawn-out battles where you whittle down your opponents one on one?

                  if so, im respeccing to something that involves skill, not just
                  "activate block and wait em out"


                  this might come across as a whine, but isnt intended as such.

                  is there some way to make florentine work with parry-builds without being an über-gimp in the end?

                  cos' im at a loss
                  Last edited by Redrum; 01-29-2008, 05:55 AM.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Originally posted by SwENSkE View Post
                    Most AVCOM missions are pretty easy IF there's enough room between the enemies so you can drag them in groups of 3 max.

                    Anyway there's one mission that's simply impossible - 'The wayward son'. It's inside and there's no way you can combat less than 5. I'm LV30 and I simply die, die, die in that mission. AVCOM is boring, boring, boring and the skills you can get are mostly useless (all these 'guard somebody else' skills are simply LOL). But if boring missions become impossible it gets ridiculous.

                    I have fencing and have done the wayward some on both my NO and FT at around level 25.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Thanks Gustave

                      I cannot believe how ignorant I was of active block. This is so necessary to not dieing and now I believe I have a firm grip of keeping it up most of the time. A preparatory attack that builds initiative on auto attack is all that is really needed it seems like, from there it is simple, just avoid attacks that lower your balance. In fencing there is one finishing move that only takes 10 balance verses the usual 40 and 50 of others.

                      The next key is never have active block drop, which is hard to do between the usual group of three, so try this. Get the guy down to a point where one more hit will kill him, now on open maps just bring that last guy into the next fight. In respawn maps if you just play with the last guy long enough the next round of three will come out before the last guy dies. Now you can kill him and move on to next target. The idea is to never be without a target in range of attack. With another target to move to you can continue your preparatory attacks to keep your initiative up so never drop active block. Without a target you cannot build initiative so you lose active block and then have to deal with its cool down, and thats how you die.

                      I have had no problem with avcom since yesterday thanks to this thread.

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by honnolea View Post
                        I have fencing and have done the wayward some on both my NO and FT at around level 25.
                        How often did you die? :P

                        BTW, I use Florentine but I sure won't respec because of simply boring and dumb missions! I just skip that kind of missions.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by SwENSkE View Post
                          How often did you die? :P

                          BTW, I use Florentine but I sure won't respec because of simply boring and dumb missions! I just skip that kind of missions.
                          you pick your battles


                          I first did this as a NO, when the dungeon wasn't extended. Again with FT and the extended dungeon.

                          You can pick your battles, patience wins.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Good topic, good advice.

                            I would add only a few things, to stress what has already been said, and to make some minor adjustments to playstyle.

                            If you are fighting a boss or more than 3 NPCs...your auto-attack should definitely be the Balance Damage attack, the best you have available. Focus on reducing the numbers as fast as possible, usually by killing normal mobs (not the boss), UNLESS you can stun the group, then focus on the boss.

                            If you are NOT fighting a boss, and have 3 or less NPCs facing you...your auto-attack should be a Health Damage attack, the best you have available. And throw in whatever area attacks you have available when you can, as long as you don't lose a ton of Balance. I think each style of combat has at least one "sweep" attack.

                            Keep an Active Defense up at all times. Even when you're "just facing two mobs" because despite what you do, it's all still pretty random. You just need a hit with a bleed and you're in real danger. If you don't feel that threatened, use Active Parry. It lasts a short time and has no penalties, besides cooldown. But that's why you should always use it. It has no real penalty.

                            Finally, "proximity pulls" are usually the best way to get their attention. Starting the fight with a pistol might be satisfying, but it's extremely unlikely that you'll kill a mob with the starting pistol shot, and then you start the fight with a lot less Balance. (Not to mention, I'm not sure, but I think shooting the pistol is huge aggro because I only seem to pull more mobs than I intended when I shoot my pistol first.)

                            Yes, I still really dislike how mobs move so quickly, without any kind of physical boundaries. And yes, I still really dislike how difficult it is to use your environment in a fight. But I still have most of my original Smelling Salts, though I'm on my last few Bandages. :P

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Just a quick thanks to all the incredibly informative posts in this thread. I have been playing this game for months without giving a lot of thought about how AvCom works- I didn't think it was fun. Understanding more about how it works and some useful strategies has made me see it in a new light. Looking forward to getting to play tonight and test out some of these strategies.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Wow... I don't agree with the active defense all the time requirement by the last couple posters... It probably works though I just don't think it's that important personally. I use active block when I'm in trouble and I'm trying to recover from some other mistake.

                                Vox Dargard

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X